Maybe we can put chastity belts on these idiots mouths!

Abstinence should, of course, be part of any sex ed curriculum. However, it is interesting to note that the United States, the country that uses "abstinence only" programs the most also has the highest teen pregnancy rates in the developed world. Who's number two? The UK, the country that uses those abstinence focus programs almost as much as we do. If we give people a number of options to prevent pregnancy -- well, then we don't need abortion nearly as often. But the right doesn't even want the morning after pill available -- despite the fact that it is NOT an abortion pill like RU-486.

Countries that have used abstinence education and given more time to talking about birth control methods -- the pill, condoms, spermicidal jellies -- they've got lower pregnancy rates. And STD's? Brazil cut their HIV infection rate by 60% just by providing condoms to more people and educating them about them.

In the pretend world where we all sip on fairy dew and hug rainbows, abstinence only education works. Here in reality -- something you have trouble with -- it just doesn't fly. Abstinence is only one part of the story, and a rather ineffectual part at that.

Abstinence is only one part of the story,

This is true, but as Josh Feit said:

"Does this strike anyone else as a cringe-worthy and counterproductive theme for a pro-choice fundraiser? It seems politically idiotic for the preeminent pro-choice group in the country to be sponsoring this pandering, pseudo-hipster 'sex positive' event."

I seems as if they were looking for some kind of counter-event and this was the best they could do.

How pathetic.

This is true, but as Josh Feit said: "Does this strike anyone else as a cringe-worthy and counterproductive theme for a pro-choice fundraiser? It seems politically idiotic for the preeminent pro-choice group in the country to be sponsoring this pandering, pseudo-hipster 'sex positive' event." I seems as if they were looking for some kind of counter-event and this was the best they could do. How pathetic.

There is nothing wrong with saying "Abstinance only is not the answer".  But to denigrate abstinance the way they did only gave the impression that it was worthless to them, and indeed, it is the most effective method (just not practiced enough).

They SAY that they are for pro-choice, yet their actions say no choice but abortion.  How many Pro Choicers would agree with that?

"Screw Abstinence"

Hehe..funny...

"Screw Abstinence" Hehe..funny...

There is nothing wrong with saying "Abstinance only is not the answer".

Absolutely. Abstinence is an important part of the modern sexual education package. The way these folks presented it seemed as if they were ridiculing abstinence, saying that it's basically worthless and laughable.

For me, being pro-choice is about supporting a woman's ability to choose. It's not about peddling abortion as the 'easy' way out, ignoring all other methods of preventing pregnancy. After all, its better to prevent an unwanted pregnancy than to kill an unwanted fetus.

"Screw Abstinence" Hehe..funny...

If it was a Mad Magazine article, sure.  If it is coming from a 'quote-unquote' responsible group, yes there is a lot that is not funny.

For me, being pro-choice is about supporting a woman's ability to choose. It's not about peddling abortion as the 'easy' way out, ignoring all other methods of preventing pregnancy. After all, its better to prevent an unwanted pregnancy than to kill an unwanted fetus.

Dharma, you got to grab the reigns back from these old bittys at NARAL, or I am afraid the loony right is going to win the day.  if these old crones keep pushing their "Abortion First and Foremost" agenda. Roe V Wade is going to be history.

While I am dead set against abortion, I do not want he pendulum to swing all the way to the right either. With antics like this, It will turn against them, and they are so fricking clueless, they will not understand why.

Preaching abstinance is fine but I'm a realist. And reality is that the great majority of people are not going to remain abstinent until they are married and then be monogomous. Yes this would be the ideal but its not reality for 99% of people. So you have to address the fact that you need to use other methods to stop the spread of STD's and unwanted pregnancies. The problem I see is that abstinance is not addressed as ONE of the ways to control STD's and pregnancy. It is always pushed as the ONLY way. There is nothing wrong with teaching abstinance as the first and ideal choice but I do think you have to go on and also explain your other options such as using condom's to control disease and the many methods of birth control that are now available.

I think the best way to get through to kids is to have them actually talk to some teenage mothers and people who have STD's so they can tell how it has changed their lives and how one sexual experience is not worth a lifetime of pain and sacrifices. I think the biggest problem is that our culture celebrates sex and sexiness over loving relationships. Most teenage girls I know don't want to be known as sweet and kind, they want to be hot and desired.

I know I was that way when I was younger and I didnt' realize until I was older and not as "hot" that so much of the attention I was getting had nothing to do with me as a person. It was just lust and hormones. I thought these guys really cared about me. Maybe it was because I was brainwashed as a Catholic school girl but I did remain a virgin until I met my husband. Of course, I didn't wait until we got married but he was the only man I was with.

Dharma, you got to grab the reigns back from these old bittys at NARAL, or I am afraid the loony right is going to win the day. if these old crones keep pushing their "Abortion First and Foremost" agenda. Roe V Wade is going to be history.

If I knew how, I would try. That organization (and a lot of others) have to stop being so reactionary. Sometimes they seem to constantly be reacting to someone else's actions rather than stating their own aims and missions. This 'screw abstinence' campaign is a perfect example of that.

Promoting absintance steers dangerously close to promoting moral behavior which is something these people simply can't tolerate. Perhaps the reason abstinance education is failing is because there are people like this promoting promiscuity as normal, expected behavior?

Yes, there are always going to be those for whom promiscuity is their preferred behavior, and they should use methods to protect themselves. But as long as we have groups sending countering messages that promiscuity is the expected and acceptable behavior our kids are getting mixed messages.

If these people were truly serious about slowing the spread of disease and unwanted pregnancy they would include the only 100% sure method as a part of their platform instead of deriding it because it hints at the possibility that certain moral values are actually a good thing and is counter to their primary platform of abortion as the best method of birth control. This speaks volumes about their true values of anti-morality and anti-life. It often seems that these people will actively oppose anything that even hints at morality.

Dr.Guy: I just thought it was a cute pun.

Personally, I think abstinence is the ideal for teens. Young people tend to be more reckless (not just my opinion, this is actually documented) which puts them at higher risk for STDs and pregnancy and they are often not prepared for the emotional damage that promiscuity can bring.

All safe sex discussions should include abstinence.

Having said that, promoting abstinence only can be dangerous. The fact is that we are sexual creatures, and teens and adults will be having sex outside the bounds of marriage, even though it may not be desirable. We all do things that aren't always good for us (not saying that sex between two unmarried partners always is, btw), but it just so happens that this particular thing can carry life long consequences.

Factual and thorough information on proper safe sex methods and birth control is essential in protecting our children. (I did note that no one on this thread has suggested that sexual education be abstinence only)

It is my hope that my children will remain virgins until they are responsible and emotionally mature, or until marriage, and I will express my feelings on this with them. However, I will also teach them about the importance of using condoms and make sure that they have access to them (hopefully in a way that does not imply that I am encouraging them to have sex, which may be a tricky thing to do).

So I agree, Dr.Guy, to dismiss or discourage abstinence is teaching our children a dangerous message (I don't have expectations of you; We are all slaves to our sexual desires). To me, a balanced approach ( abstinence is a great option because..., safe sex is important because...) is best.

Dharma:

After all, its better to prevent an unwanted pregnancy than to kill an unwanted fetus.

I think this is sooo important, and something that prolifers and prochoicers and rightwing and leftwing should be able to come together on.

Preaching abstinance is fine but I'm a realist. And reality is that the great majority of people are not going to remain abstinent until they are married and then be monogomous. Yes this would be the ideal but its not reality for 99% of people.

Your stats are way off base, but even if true, it still works for those who try it.  And while it is not the only solution, it is the best solution.  To denigrate it from a supposed (and I use the term very lightly) responsible organization is incompetant in the extreme and lays bare their lies that Abortion is a last resort.  To them, Abortion is the only resort.  Their hypocrisy reeks as does their agenda.

If I knew how, I would try. That organization (and a lot of others) have to stop being so reactionary. Sometimes they seem to constantly be reacting to someone else's actions rather than stating their own aims and missions. This 'screw abstinence' campaign is a perfect example of that.

You are a very wise person.  If I knew a way to smack some sense into their pin heads, I would be on the front lines helping you.