A line from a movie {the last dragon} comes to mind , the bad guy screams who's the mastah!! and all the little lackies shout "sho nuff"

The devil is our master!

Oh...I'm sorry! Karl Rove works for dubya...My bad! : :

The devil is our master! Oh...I'm sorry! Karl Rove works for dubya...My bad! :

Too bad you dont question your own clowns...errr 'Leaders'.

Bolton on is the fact that he called the UN a corrupt and irrelevant organization that has lost its usefulness.

That's the main reason I am against him. I mean why nominate someone as your representative to a bdy that has contempt for that body.

It would be liike the Truman announcing that McCarthy would be the ambassador to the USSR.

Unless, Bush wants to show his contempt for the body by sending someone that would not work with them.

That's not it. Bush is a uniter, not a divider, right?

IG

That's the main reason I am against him. I mean why nominate someone as your representative to a bdy that has contempt for that body. It would be liike the Truman announcing that McCarthy would be the ambassador to the USSR.

You did not read it to the end.  Should the American Soviet ambassador of the 60s 70s and 80s pledged undying fealty to Communism?  Or should he have been an American who sought the best for America?

it seems that with the end of the cold war, so has the end of Diplomacy occured, and now we are relegated to world order sycophants.

What he said is 100% correct!  Do you think any politician, democrat or Republican would have survived after that fiasco that kofi oversaw?

Of course he has contempt for that body!  As does a majority of Americans!  That body is contemptous!

You did not read it to the end. Should the American Soviet ambassador of the 60s 70s and 80s pledged undying fealty to Communism? Or should he have been an American who sought the best for America?

Fealty is not the question. Do we want the ambassador to keep America's interest in the forefront, yes, but the man we put in the UN also has to have a willingness to work with the body to acomplish some of it's goals.

IG

Fealty is not the question. Do we want the ambassador to keep America's interest in the forefront, yes, but the man we put in the UN also has to have a willingness to work with the body to acomplish some of it's goals.

A Career diplomat can.  But everyone, at times, calls a spade a spade.  Dont confuse the 2.

After all, both jean kirkpatrick and Daniel Moynihan had just as much contempt as Bolton, and both were democrats (and good ones).

Dont confuse submission with diplomacy.  That is the trap that the world 'democrats' want you to fall into.

A line from a movie {the last dragon} comes to mind , the bad guy screams who's the mastah!! and all the little lackies shout "sho nuff"

Was that the Democrat convention?

I may be wrong, but were either Moynihan or Kirkpatric that openly hostile to the UN? It's just that I would have a difficuly time working with a man who I see every day on CNN saying how corrupt I am and that the work I do is unnecessary.

IG

I may be wrong, but were either Moynihan or Kirkpatric that openly hostile to the UN? It's just that I would have a difficuly time working with a man who I see every day on CNN saying how corrupt I am and that the work I do is unnecessary.

At their time, the UN was East vs West.  So there was no Kofi or Kofu.  But yes they were for the time.

You fell for the trap.  ANY ambasador must first and foremost represent their own people.  That goes for the US and every country.

If they do not, they are not worth spit.  Both Moynihan and Kirkpatrick were great because they did just that, and called a spade a spade.  And both were democrats, and good ones.  Not many of them left.

Diplomacy is not sucumbing to the will of the other side.  it is holding up your side and making the others feel they are important, whether it is warranted or not.  Bolton has shown he can do that, but everyone but the most mypoic knows that it (the UN) needs to be bitch slapped right now.  And he is the man to do it.

Diplomacy is not sucumbing to the will of the other side.

True, but in Diplomacy there must also be a willingness to compromise in order to reach a solution. Both parties cannot be so entrenched in thier positions that nothing gets done, by the same token one side cannot keep surrendering to the other.

Bolton may be the one, but he does not seem to be the type to see the other person's point of view.

IG

True, but in Diplomacy there must also be a willingness to compromise in order to reach a solution. Both parties cannot be so entrenched in thier positions that nothing gets done, by the same token one side cannot keep surrendering to the other. Bolton may be the one, but he does not seem to be the type to see the other person's point of view.

First part, very good!  And an excellant!

Second part, also good, but we will disagree!  I think he is in the mold of KirkPatrick and Moynihan.  Rhetoric is fine, but a good one knows where it stops and diplomacy begins.  I think Bolton does know as he understands the international scene.

Thank you for an intelligent and good debate.  We dont have to agree on everything to understand the issues and just see differing solutions.

True, but in Diplomacy there must also be a willingness to compromise in order to reach a solution.

This attitude is actually what is killing Diplomacy in general. Diplomacy is not about comprimising one's own convictions in ordder to reach a solution. Diplomacy is standing for one's convictions, talking things out with the rest of the body, making decisions and voting on issues based on what you learned from the discussions, and accepting the outcome of the vote.

Comprimise is merely being thrown around by whatever wind is blowing weak-minded leaders to whatever he or she thinks will offer the most reward, or the least damage on impact. When I hear our leaders speak of a need to play "mother may I" games with the UN, I vomit! When I hear Supreme Court Justices use reference to practices in other nations, instead of Constitutional arguments, I weep for our Constitution and wonder how they can live with themselves. They obviously have NO CLUE of what their job entails.

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The United Nations should never be anything more or less than a organization where diplomats from the world can get together to hash out international differences. Not one of those diplomats should be there to play "yes man" to the leadership of the UN. Each should be there to act as the voice of their nation. Anything less is just a waste of their paycheck.

If Senators have a difficult time confirming a candidate who questions the validity of the UN, maybe they should re-examine their relationship with truth in general!

If Senators have a difficult time confirming a candidate who questions the validity of the UN, maybe they should re-examine their relationship with truth in general!

Senators? Truth? Somehow those 2 words dont seem to fit together very well!